So many choices, but only one chance to get it right. Please lend your expertise and help us find the perfect beer for Jill.
I stopped in this morning to get my hair cut by my buddy Jill. She’s super-talented with scissors and it’s always a long wait to get in her chair, but not if you slide in first thing on a Wednesday morning, which is exactly what I did. While I was there, we started talking about beer (go figure) and what might be a good one to show Jill, a wine lover, just what she’s missing out on.
Jill loves big flavors and enjoys the occasional beer, and she’s excited to try something new. The question is what. Well, that’s where you come in. Please use your beer expertise to suggest a beer or two that you think she’ll love. When all suggestions are in, I’ll pick a winner, buy the beer and deliver it to Jill. She’ll try it and let us all know how it went. Of course, you’ll need a little info about the kind of stuff Jill likes…Jill likes big flavor. When it comes to wine, she usually goes for a Merlot, which is rich, complex, earthy and a little spicy. This bodes well for recommending a big beer, no training wheels required. She’ll sometimes do a Beaujolais, but doesn’t like it when a wine is too sweet, another guardrail to keep in mind (sorry Duchesse De Bourgogne, you’re out!). Jill also likes rich foods and stuff with a kick, like Mexican. I also asked if she likes dates and raisins, and indeed she does. Another piece of the puzzle, I think.
On the beer front, she’s only had pretty run of the mill stuff, but leans towards Bass and Newcastle and away from Bud (smart lady). She also likes Guinness, but it can be a bit heavy for her, something else to keep in mind. She’s had Boulder Beer’s Hazed and Infused American Pale Ale, which she enjoyed, as well as a hoppy beer that “tasted like a Christmas tree” which was okay by her as well.
So there you have it. Any recommendations you’d like to share are greatly appreciated. The goal is to blow Jill’s mind with a beer that rivals her favorite wines in terms of flavor, complexity and drinking pleasure. After a day or two, I’ll look through the comments, declare a “winner” (or two) and get the beer in Jill’s hands. She has promised to report back on what she thinks.
So dig deep, beer nerds – this is a chance to convert an open-minded wine lover to the wonders of craft beer. Godspeed!
Beer & Whiskey Brothers 
It’s a bummer this is a “one shot deal” to wow Jill. Women’s palates are much more discerning than our male counterparts. Craft beer enjoyment takes time. It took me quite a while to find my favorite craft beer. I still love to try out all of the collaborations, new releases, and beers I’ve never heard of before. She is on the right path with Newcastle. That is my “gateway” beer into craft beer with girlfriends who say they don’t like beer after only ever having Miller Lite. My favorite craft beer (right now…my palate has changed over the years and took a big hit while I was pregnant) is Sun King Wee Mac from Indianapolis. It’s smooth and has a wonderful flavor. I’ve been into the Scottish Style ales this year since hoppy beers don’t really do it for me right now (again that palate thing). I also really enjoy Founders Cerise. Cherry pie in a glass, but I can’t drink more than one bottle of it since it’s so sweet.
I wish Jill the best of luck – but like everything else – finding your favorite craft beer is going to take patience and time. There’s too much good craft beer out there to pigeon hole yourself!
I agree that baby steps works, but as Jill is someone who drinks “big” wines, I’d love to skip all that and find her a “big” beer that’s an epiphany for her. It’s a tough nut to crack…
My first thought would be a Belgian, like a dubbel or even a tripel as they usually have the fruity overtones, but not too sweet, that are appealing yet bold enough for the “experienced” drinker – Chimay Blue or Ommegang Abbey Ale springs to mind as they are found at most liquor stores.
Safe choices, Rob. Very safe. But what’s something you really love that’s super big and complex? Maybe even barrel-aged?
OK…how about Lagunitas Hairy Eyeball or Troegs Mad Elf? I was afraid they may be too big for someone trying to cross the path from Newcastle into something a bit bolder.
Ooh, I like the Mad Elf idea – I have two in the garage. Hairy eyeball is another great idea. I also have a case of Dragon’s Milk on order (call it love!) and might share one of those as well.
Crap I was going to recommend sours by I was grounded before even taking off.
Sorry about that! I think the whole “not too sweet” thing only leaves sours that aren’t sweet enough for a noob. It’s quite a conundrum!
OK Jim, I’m thinking Ommegang Three Philosophers. It has quite a bit more kick than Chimay Blue, but won’t blow her head off like Storm King. Another good choice is from our friends at Victory. Old Horizontal and Helious. Both are great beers with big flavors and in completely different directions. The Old Horizontal Barley Wine also has Wine in the title so it should be familiar, see there is the whole “Wine Connection” thing happening there. Always thinkin’…
I’d like to find something with more of a wine-like quality than going Belgian. It’s a safe bet, but I’d like something with more of a twist, something a little weird and a bit fancy. That’s why the Duchesse De Bourgogne is always so tempting here, what with it’s fancy cork and all…
OH isn’t a Belgian? and like I said, it has wine in the title…how can it miss?
I’m a little afraid of going with a big barley wine is all. Might be too pungent for a wine lover, but she does like dried dark fruits, so it might be right up her ally…
OH is a great Barley Wine. How do I know? Because I’m not a huge Barley Wine fan, but I love OH. That is why I think it might work well. It really isn’t pungent at all, and with the bigger ABV it will have that familiar wine punch.
My thinking would be something like a DFH, Raisen d’Etra, or Midas Touch.. Just a thought, they are very complex, full of flavor, and different from what is expected in a beer. They also enable great conversation about the creative process of beer design and brewing. They will not overwhelm with hop bitterness or anything else that requires a beer geek palate to appreciate. Finally, they are a world away from what Jill might have experienced beer to be, and that… is the name of the game.
Good stuff, Bill. I think Midas Touch really threads the needle between wine-like qualities without being too sweet. I was also thing a DFH Fort, but that might be too sweet. Maybe even a White and Red.
I’m going to recommend a few things:
Allagash. For me, the White in particular is an all-around drinkable brew, but one to try if you like big flavors and can find it is the Curieux: http://www.allagash.com/curieux.htm
Victory. I love the Golden Monkey because of the aroma, the mouth-feel, and its deceptively light flavor with the big alcohol punch, but she may find it a little sweet because of the coriander. http://www.victorybeer.com/golden_monkey.aspx
512 Brewing. http://512brewing.com/beers.php I love the Wit, the grapefruit flavors help keep it from being overly sweet, and gives it a bit of a bite, but everyone in Austin loves the Pecan Porter which is rich and nutty and is also excellent in cupcakes. 🙂
=h=
=h=
Good suggestions, Holly. Allagash is a go-to pick for converting wine lovers, usually those who are into Chardonnay’s or other dry/sweet whites.
I didn’t think about Golden Monkey, but it’s a great suggestion. It’s corked (fancy/novel) has big flavor and is very drinkable / not too heavy. And as you say, it packs a nice little punch like a bottle of wine might. Hmmm…
I’m not familiar with 512, but I’m jealous that you are! 🙂
Raisen d’Etra:
Food Pairing Recommendations:
Steak, duck, game, wine-reduction sauces, Blue cheese, goat cheese, ham, mussels
Glassware Recommendation:
Goblet or Snifter
Tasting Notes:
pit fruit, decadent, winey, raisiney, malty
Wine Comparable:
Bordeaux
Definitely hits on the malty/date-like qualities. DFH is always a good place to explore what beer can be. I can think of five or six DFH beers I’d recommend, and none of them are IPA’s.
I’d go with something unusal, something different, barrel aged perhaps? My vote is Russian River Brewing’s ‘Consecration’ it’s a dark (sour) ale, aged in cab barrels. At 10% ABV it’s meant to be enjoyed like a wine. The flavors are complex it has a belgian feel to it and it is just plain de-lish! Happy sampling!
That sounds perfect, Paulette! Off the beaten path, barrel-aged, and packing a nice punch. Too bad we’re in New Jersey and don’t get Russian River here – No Pliney, no Consecration, no nothing! I’ll have to get out there one day for sure. Thanks for the wonderful recommendation.
It’s definately worth a trip, there are so many local craft brews in the area… Lauganitas, 21st Amendment, Thirsty Bear, Marin Brew Co., Drakes Brewing, the list goes on all within an hour and a half drive. I feel your pain though because I love Brooklyn Brew & Magic Hat and can’t get it here unless I buy through a distributor and it gets pricey!
Living out east does have its advantages, but I’m getting tired of reading and seeing (and not tasting) how great Russian River’s stuff is. Maybe we can swap houses for a week…
Ok, so while Jill will have to be really careful with this 12% barleywine- I completely and wholeheartedly suggest Otter Creek’s Quercus Vitis Humulus. http://www.ottercreekbrewing.com/otter_creek/beers/Imperial_Series.html
I absolutely loved this brew. It is grape-y and hoppy, which sounds right up Jill’s alley. It is also very complex, with lots of hints of different fruits and a great oak undertone which makes it not super sweet. Lastly- since the ABV is so high on this brew, it’s a nice sipping beer, which means that Jill can slowly get used to the tastes and take her time getting acquainted with and enjoying what in her glass.
Cheers, Jill!
-Stevie Caldarola (of Ladies of Craft Beer and BasicallyRed)
Website: http://basicallyread.wordpress.com/
Twitter: http://twitter.com/BasicallyRed
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/steviecald
http://www.facebook.com/basicallyred
BrewYork: http://www.facebook.com/BrewYork
Ladies Of Craft Beer:http://www.twitter.com/LadiesOCB
http://www.facebook.com/LadiesOCB
Live Simply, Laugh Often, Love Deeply
You know, a barleywine sounds like a bad idea coming from Don, but a great idea coming from you, Stevie! I think I can get this around here, so I’ll definitely check it out (for myself as well). Thanks for the suggestion.
Sure thing! QVH was one of my first barleywines (I was at a festival at the time) and I had it on cask and immediately fell in love! Best of luck to you and Jill on this, no matter what you end up picking.
Should Jill like what you pick and be further interested in pursuing craft beer (which I hope she is, as a fellow lady convert myself,) have her check out Ladies Of Craft Beer- women educating other women on the wonderful world of craft beer.
Cheers!
Oh Jim, you are so transparent and shallow! See what I have to put up with Stevie?
Now now, boys- can’t we all just get along and drink a barleywine?
Well…ok. But just because you said Stevie, not because I actually like Jim. He’s mean and a judgmental Bastard. Just sayin’.
Nothing like women and beer to bring two brothers together…
Actually, it’s usually women and beer that cause problems between fellas, especially when there’s lots of beer and few women. But in this case, yes, they are the two things that keep us properly sedated and in line.
Lots of good suggestions! I’d third the Barley wine suggestion and I rather enjoyed Avery’s Hog Heaven when I was dressing in my wife’s clothes. (Did I say that out loud???) Something else that comes to mind would be something like Unibrau’s Maudite or other Belgian strong dark ale. Lots of good choices there.
Maudite is my wife’s favorite, Scott (along with Storm King), and there’s usually a bottle in the house. I guess I got burned out on Belgian yeast (especially when they produce metallic esters like in Unibroue’s beers) and it’s making me shy away from recommending one. But Belgian strong ales are a great gateway into craft beer for someone who likes big flavors.
And, as much as it pains me to say it, it looks like Don was r…r…r…correct when he suggested a barleywine. I’m sure I’ll be hearing about this…
Newcastle was the first beer that I actually liked. One of my favorites is Hobgoblin, which is generally easy to find here on the East Coast.
http://www.wychwood.co.uk/
I second the Dogfish Head recommendations from above.
The Hobgoblin looks like a logical leap from Newcastle, Sarah. Not too “big” but it sounds like a complex and satisfying beer (I’ve never had one).
And it’s looking like I’ll have to bring more than one beer to Jill, and a DFH brew will definitely be in the mix.
O.K. Jim, you’re throwing me with, “she usually goes for a Merlot, which is rich, complex, earthy and a little spicy.” Merlots are fruity and can have big flavor but they are fairly simple and straightforward. Rich and complex is the realm of cabernets and at the opposite side of the red wine tasting spectrum. Beaujolais is fruity but even lighter than merlot.
Having said that, I’d go with something that is intriguing, interesting but has a high drinkability factor (which both those wine types have). It would also be fun to do something light and dark (a white and a red in wine terms).
On the lighter side, maybe a saison or wheat wine. Boulevard’s Harvest Dance wheat wine is quite complex but light. A Saison Dupont or Saison D’Erpe-Mele would be highly interesting to. Plus, both are very approachable. And they have the whole french connection going on, which is an interesting parallel to wine.
Since she seems O.K. with piney, perhaps a double/imperial IPA is a good choice. Souther Tier Unearthly or Great Divide Brewing’s 15th Anniversary are highly drinkable/sippable. The 15th has the oak aging going on, the extra malt in both takes some of the hop edge off. And the ABV in both is very wine-like.
Good choices from everyone here and a fun challenge Jim. Good luck!
Thanks for calling me out on my embarrassingly inept wine description – there’s a reason why “Wine” isn’t part of the title of our site!
I agree that light and dark would be fun to play with, and that something with real hop character could be nice to throw in. I’m to the point where I want to put together a case of bombers for her – a barleywine, a slightly fruity Dogfish Head offering, a saison, a Nugget Nectar, maybe a Belgian Trippel, something barrel aged, etc., etc. Unfortunately that isn’t what this challenge is all about. Decision, decisions!
This is actually going to be quite difficult. I think I need to set a three bottle limit.
No worries, Jim. Don’t tell anyone but admittedly I was little bit of a wine geek before I became a total beer nerd.
Mmmmm Nugget Nectar… ::Homer Simpson-style drool:: This convo is NSFW!
You certainly have a tall task ahead of you in trying to pick the “perfect” beer to introduce someone into the world of craft brewing. I thought of another beer that I absolutely loved that I had recently and was reminded of while reading the last response from Beer Poet – Southern Tier’s Gemini – a blend of their Imperial IPA (Unearthly) and their Hoppe (Imperial Pale Ale).
Best of luck, no pressure of course. Can’t wait to hear what you decide to go with.
Ha ha – that’s also a great way to squeeze two styles into one bottle, Rob – genius!!
You’re right that this is going to be tough. It’s also making me very thirsty.
If I didn’t have a doctors appointment after work, I would be cracking open that bottle of Nugget Nectar I’ve been saving.
Like Beer Poet, I was a bit of a wine nerd and made the switch to the dark side…beer is just so much cooler.
I couldn’t understand people being into wine until I got into beer – then I got how you could get so pumped up about the nuances of a beverage. I’m starting to think I could become a wine guy, but then I look at all the beer I have yet to discover…
I’m a girl who is into big bitter beers so how about River Horse’s Hopalotamus or Victory’s Hop Devil or maybe Legacy Brewing’s Hoptimus Prime? Those are all extremely delicious.
Those are all goodies, Indeed, and easy to get a hold of in these parts. Maybe I should just give in and grab a Victory sampler…
I think she should try Jim’s Oaked Bourbon stout
That would stop all this beer-talk rather quickly. And maybe any eye contact when she cuts my hair as well, Nate.
I slso like bold red wines & not wines that are too sweet. My recommendations are: Russian River Damnation, Lost Abbey Inferno or Delrium Tremens. For an IPA- Green Flash West Coast IPA- incredibly easy-drinking & agreeable beer- YUM, now I’m craving the stuff.
I’m going to guess you live out West, Elsa, as the beers you have listed flow freely on the sunnier side of the Rockies. I’m not sure I can get anything but the Delirium (which is excellent and a great reco) around here.
I’m going to have to plan a trip out to California soon. One that I can drink my way through so I can catch up with all the goodies out there, especially Russian River. Now if I can just find a work conference in San Diego…
All I want for Christmas is a Pliny the Elder…
Amen! But I’ve been very, very bad…
The Delirum Nocturnum is a bit more rich than the Tremens, I’d go with that if you can find it (but that may be a saesonal). Orval is always a great one too, it’s in my top 10.
If you head out west come to N. Cal – SF bay area has soem awesone breweries!
There’s usually some Nocturnum kicking around the shelves, so it shouldn’t be a problem. I fear if I ever go to California I won’t leave (or at least not after gaining 200 pounds and growing a Jim Morrison beard)!
Amen Brother!!
fyi
N. Cal also has St. George Spirits which makes a nice whiskey, they are partnered with Hanger One which make the most beautiful vodkas! They have a tasting room and tours.
You will never leave or at least you won’t want to…
OK Paulette, Are you with the N. Cal Chamber of Commerce? Seriously, it sounds like a wonka land for adults! St. George Spirits sounds like it is right up my alley! That’s it, we need a road trip!
Sounds like our kind of place, Paulette. Not sure about doing a walking tour though. Do they have a tram that you can slosh yourself into? That’d be perfect.
Not much walking required (mostly just standing), I’ve only actually been to Hanger One (they carry the St. George and you can sample there) it’s in an old airplane hanger on an old naval base in Alameda, in the middle of no where (Alameda is near Oakland). The tour is actually the really cool staff talking about what they do and love ‘booze’. Then they have a tasting room. Tours are only at 1pm on Sat & Sun. If you ever make it out it’s definately worth checking out. Russian River is in Santa Rosa, CA which is in “wine country”. It’s a beautiful area, you can also go to the Charles Schultz museum if you’re into the Peanuts. Guy Fieri has a place called Tex Wasabi’s which is a couple blocks down the street from Russina River Brewing if you’re looking for an interesting mix of food or just like Triple D.
Laganitas is just 20 minutes south of Santa Rosa in Petaluma, it’s a really short tour, mostly history of the place, they have a ‘beer garden’ there, it’s a small fun place filled with locals, if you like the hoppy beers it’s always got something good. Keep heading south down the 101 and stop at Moylans in Novato, then Marin Brewing Co in Larkspur, then head down to SF to 21st Amendment, then Thirsty Bear Brewing, Go East to Berkeley and hit Pyramid Brewing and Hanger One/St. George Spirits. That will easily take a week.
Delerium Tremens was my gateway brew. I was goner after that. Nocturnum would work equally as well.
Whoops. Meant Nocturnum on that second Delirium reference.
Fixed it for you with my magical blogging powers, Chad.
I always forget about these beers, but I’m always impressed when I have their stuff.
Me too, actually. Drank a lot of Delirium early on (and Belgians in general). Then moved on to American craft ales. Always pleasantly reminded when I go back to a familiar Belgian at how brilliant they are.
That’s exactly what I did, too, Chad. I started with Chimay Red and then worked my way through Belgium, then to American stouts and ale, then to barrel aged anything (seriously, Poland Spring would be better in oak), to sours to whatever comes next, perhaps even a fling with pilsners. A non-metallic Belgian definitely has to be part of the mix for Jill.
Yeah…Like maybe Three Philosophers like I said about 8 hours ago DUH!
I’m not sure about Three Philosophers, Don. It’s delish, but there’s a earthy, tart skunkiness in that one that is nice, but could be off putting to someone green to the craft beer scene.
In your face, Don! Ha!
I mean, um, very valid point there Chad.
Yeah Chad, but Jim keeps saying her palate is more sophisticated and that she can handle bigger flavors. Unless he is wrong about that too like he was about the wine!
Don, she likes Merlot and Beaujolais. Nothing at all wrong with that. But based on those wine styles, I’d err on the side of beer that’s intriguing, unique, maybe complex but definitely has to be approachable. Baby steps my friend.
How about a Petrus Old Brown? Can you get that out there in Jersey? It’s barrel aged, not sure about the ABV but I think it’s pretty high. It’s got a rich brown flavor that a Newcastle fan would like but it’s also complex and a tad sour from the frementation.
I’m not sure about Petrus in NJ, but I’m going to look into it – you’re the second person to mention them to me today (the other was on twitter). I just so happen to be stopping by the beer store tonight to pick up a case (!) of New Holland’s Dragon’s Milk, so I’ll ask after it. I’m intrigued…
Lots of good suggestions so far… I wholeheartedly endorse the idea of a Saison such as Saison Rue from the Bruery or a Trappist/Abbey Ale whether it be domestic or imported. I like the offerings from Unibroue, all the Trappist beers, and Ommegang. I’m thinking Three Philosophers.
But now, I must diverge from the pack and suggest a dopplebock. While Salvator is the standard bearer in this category, I’d recommend Celebrator from Ayinger. It is complex, yet ever so smooth. Plus, the bottle comes with an ornament. Taking the dopplebock one step further, twisting it with wheat malt, Aventinus from Schneider & Sohn is amazing, especially on draught.
I hadn’t considered a dopplebock, but it’s broad shouldered and smooth, which would be a hit. And the fact that Celebrator comes with a doodad shouldn’t be overlooked!
Trappiste Rocheforte #8 or Duvel. Both have a wine-like quality and fruity overtones, particularly the #8. Great blog, by the way.
Trappist Rochefort 8 is one of my all time favorites and I almost picked one up for her. I decided something with a fancy cork would have more of a “wow” factor. Shallow, I know, but some people are blown away by uncorking a beer. It helps them see it in a new light.
Thanks for the props on the blog. We never get tired of that!